American Morning
China Rising: Assessing China's impact on America
Editor's Note: Before the turn of the century, it was considered a "no brainer" for U.S. businesses: you had to be in China. Fast forward ten years and you have to ask the question, "has China been good or bad for America?" This week in our original series "China Rising," we're assessing China's economic impact on the United States. Tomorrow on American Morning, Christine Romans examines how China has changed American businesses. One look at your dinner table will tell you everything you need to know.
By Christine Romans, CNN
(CNN) – The question nine years after China was admitted to the World Trade Organization and officially welcomed in to the world economy is this: Has China's rise been good or bad for America?
Meet Steve Udden. He is a husband, father of two daughters and a trade statistic.
"I felt like a baseball player that got traded from a team that he loved playing for and loved the fans. I loved my customers; my coworkers were like second family to me," he explains.
His job as a telecoms projects manager went overseas to China when his factory moved there. Classified by the U.S. government as a casualty of foreign trade qualifies him for a stipend and money for retraining. Unemployment benefits and COBRA health insurance help fill the gap.
“We are keeping it level and steady and holding the line and right now we are ok.”
He's the face of the increasingly strained relations between the United States and China.
One think-tank estimates 2.4 million manufacturing jobs were lost between 2001-2008.
With China's explosive rise comes a nation that is now a key player in America's domestic and foreign policy. Take its currency: Anything made in China is cheaper than made in the USA. Why?
“They arbitrarily control the value of their currency and they do not allow it to float, like most other currencies in which supply and demand for the currency set the value of it,” explains Dan Slane of the U.S.-China Economic and Security Review Commission.
That means one dollar is always equal to roughly 6.83 Yuan.
“The manipulation of their currency gives them about a 40% advantage and it puts our exporters at an enormous disadvantage,” says Slane.
The Treasury secretary abruptly postponed releasing a report this week that could have listed China as a currency manipulator, opting for backroom diplomacy and a closed-door meeting in Beijing. This comes just before China's President Hu Jintao comes to Washington for nuclear talks.
“That's good. We're not going to hang him out to dry politically while he's here, which would be disastrous,” says Robert Kapp, a China trade and business consultant.
And then there's this: Pressuring China is tricky. China is America's banker, the world's factory floor. It’s building its military, buying more of the world's natural resources to fuel its growth and it doesn't like Americans telling it what to do.
“The Chinese [are] showing a new assertiveness and aggressiveness that took many Americans by surprise… I think it's partly because they're starting to listen to what we say about this being China's century and then they started to internalize it and say: Well if this is our century, then we should determine what goes on,” says Gordon Chang, author of "The Coming Collapse of China."
Chang: China may need America more than America needs China 
At the same time, the United States needs China's influence with emerging nuclear threats in North Korea and Iran.
“Thus far, the Chinese and U.S. have clearly not been of one mind. The Chinese have said over and over, oh, we're going to do it diplomatically, let's negotiate and the Americans have gotten more and more impatient and tried to move the world in the direction of difficult sanctions,” says Kapp.
As the temperature rises, the American people wonder: Is China an opportunity or a threat?
“It's going to be both. And the question is, on balance, is it better or is it worse,” says Chang.
It is a question that is unanswered for Steve Udden.
He is still out of work in Foxboro, Massachusetts. His job is now somewhere in China.
His outlook is quintessentially American.
“I'm completely optimistic and believe in the marrow of my bones that I am going to find something that is good for me and my wife and children.
Publicly, the Chinese dismiss the Obama administration’s calls to let its currency rise. Chinese officials insist the United States is using Beijing as a scapegoat for its own economic troubles.
Premier Wen Jiabao, in rare public comments, recently scolded the President Obama and called America's attitude "protectionist." He said the United States has too many of its own problems to interfere in how China chooses to do business.
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Well,,, I thought this 8 or 9 years ago, in conversation with my brother who works for a US oil company he helped to setup in Beijing, at that time. The outcome was basically a no brainer to both of us even then. The early success of foreign companies there has become more about capitilizing anymore, to all of those involved in trade with CHINA. Nothing is going to stop now. They will be smiling in the end.
Products of the UK and transferred to the US in the late 70's while oil was still booming we have watched a slow but deliberate shift in global economy. I am sure, if two average people could see the outcome of the trade agreements just about a decade ago, then out great finacial WIZARDS could see it. I think it is pure GREED at any cost!
~ ~ A pattern ~~
The US and Europe showed the Middle East 60 years ago how to drill for oil... Now look at what has happened!!! Our knowledge & willingness to help is now costing billions to buy back. What will this mistake cost? World wide financial bankruptcy with a NEW WORLD SUPERPOWER!!
~ ~ CHINA ~ ~ Not Russia, Not the United States of America.
My brother willingly went. An excellent pay check. Who would say, "No?" His wife and family still live in China, while the kids finish out their education in the next couple of years at an excellent international school. I have stayed in the States; he has worked in Nigeria, Venezuela and now back in Saudi. Look at who the power is shifting towards and where it is being taken from.
While half the modern world continues to outsource jobs, slow strangulation takes place at their expensr and a gain for others.
The commentaries on this forum proved just how uninformed many Americans are. So is it fair for U.S. government to subsidies and dump produce goods into 3rd world countries? Ask the local farmers in those countries how they feel?
There was a time when many thought that Japan was a big threat because they invested so much in US. What happened to the "Buy American" propaganda? What happened to the automakers, they bailed out and moved their plants to Canada and Mexico as soon as NAFTA was signed. Corporation are only loyal to one thing and that is profits! People are easily manipulated by their politician and news media. If you truly are Patriotic and want to help, then start by voting! Not just partisan, but be open- minded and know who are voting and where they stand. Stop relying so much on your government to do everything for you. Save money, stop spending what you don't have (same goes for our politicians) and excercise more. That would lessen our country's dependency on foreign goods, reduce your own financial risk, cut personal and government healthcare cost, and hopefully put more qualified politicians that will steer our great country back in the right direction. To this day, I don't get how people can vote Marion Barry back into office again. Then again this just prove my point.
This thread of people all forgot to mention "GLOBALISATION got us here". US championed this direction in the last 10 years and it all hit us so hard now ...resources drained, weather changed...2012 on its way. And India is right behind, so make sure you greedy Americans don't make the same mistake...
from a Malaysian
China was once a superpower of the world for many many times long before the West. Dynasty rises and falls all the time through out the history, please do not feel bad if America is slipping behind. Your time will come again, let say another 500 years or so, you just have to be patience. Patience is virtue, my friends
Don't blame other people for your own problems. The American is losing its competition with China mostly because of its super-high labor costs, which is the main cause that American corsp move their manufacturing dept to China or other low-cost countries. Look at the telecom industry and the auto industry. You can sense something really wrong here. American ever dominated both industries, but now they are all done to China. If GM or Ford needs to pay 5-10 times of labor costs to make cars as their chinese competitors do, GM and Ford will eventually lose in the competition with Chinese auto makers.
Another big issue is the sky-high national debts. With more than $10T national debts, US$ will become weaker and weaker, and you will see very soon that the world currencies will not longer be US$, but Euro and Yuan.
American still has chances to keep its position as a super power, sharing with China, IF the whole nation and the government can all wake up, stop living on borrowig money, low down the labor costs, and invest more in education for our next generations. But the hope is very slim, since we are not facing and solving our own problems, but blaming other people growing too fast, or becoming too strong.
So Sad, American.
I am amazed at how Obama gets the blame for the eight years that Bush and the republicans were in office.
i am from kenya and a big beneficiary of both china and USA but one wonders at how much of a bully the usa can be. you are so jealous of other people developing...............in my native area a saying goes " ley your neighbour thrive if you dont like it change houses or better still marry his daughter" leave the chinese alone. work hard or just peg ur currency as well.or i forgot u invented capitalism lol
I always find strange that we Americans always blame someone else for our own problems. Every major issues facing this country has been always blamed on someone or something. It is always someone else fault. When are we going to start taking responsibility so as to tackle our issues currently plaguing our country. China steal jobs, no we sell our jobs to China by going to place that carries "Made in China" products. The rising cost of healthcare so we blame insurance companies but then at the same time we are fattest people in this world. Financial meltdown and so we blame financial institution for tempting us to pay things that we don't need like 50 inch HDTV and other unnecessary luxury items. So, when are we going to grow up and start taking responsibility and also when are going to start demanding from our politicians to stop selling themselves to the highest contributors. Wake up!
I believe that all the countries of the world should have an equal standing as far as there should be a single global monetary currency.
Countries may start acting more like collaborators rather than prey and victim if there was a single monetary unit were in place.
I am not saying all of the countries of the world should be united into one nation, only establishing an equal playing field.
It is well known that wars are fought over gold. In the future wars are going to be fought over trade imbalances which is more than equivalent to gold.
Having an international currency will not solve all the problems of the world but I do think it will take the straw off the camels back.
Many U.S. citizen are out of work because of global currency profit. It is simple math. If you can pay someone in a foreign nation 2 dollars a day to make your product and an Americans cost of living does not permit this than the company wanting to produce that product will go overseas…are these foreign workers paying U.S. income taxes?
get ready to feel the pain.
What would happen if the Chinese Yuan appreciate? The stuff you buy at walmart will be more expensive. Is that good for you average Joes out there? I don't know. The Jobs will leave China, but will they come back to the U.S.? Hell no. The jobs will always go where the cost is the lowest and that definitely is not here. Vietnam, for example, has about 1/3 of the U.S. population and a young, giant work force. India is larged untapped on its manufcuturing potentials. Dream on Americans.
If anybody thinks that China is just trying to get even with the US they need to think again. Our engineering company has done mfg with China and we have seen the following problems:
1. Central Goverment running the "Capitalism" and the non-float of money is just the beginning.
2. They will sell you finished goods by the ton, but to by parts to mfg in the USA will costs both a long lead time and a added cost. They don't want anyone mgf in the USA!
3. No patent protections, stuff comes ourt the back door rebranded to compete with your product.
4. Yes, the labor is cheep but it does not pay US taxes for police, fire schools etc. Is it worth the 5% cheeper cost after shipping?
5. This China monetary control thing will make Credit Default Swaps/Bank Colapse look like a sunburn.
6. Wake up America; manage our "Captalisim", it is not fee enterprize anymore, China see this why can't you.
Foxconn make the phone in China on behalf of Apple
buy only mde in USA and lol
There were NET ZERO private sector jobs created the entire duration of the Bush administration. NONE. For EIGHT YEARS. Look it up at the Bureau of Labor Statistics. If you want to know when the country went down the toilet, look no further.
You are all a bunch of babbling fools. The economy didn't fall because we put millions into our military for the wars we are in. We have always financed our military. The economy didn't fall because jobs went overseas. This practice has gone on for years. The economy has crashed quite simply from greed. If a company doesn't make what it wants it fires employees to increase the income for those at the top of the ladder. People sacrifice quality for cheaper. They have the illusion that they save money when in fact cheaper price also means cheap quality and we replace things more often. My first VCR cost me $400 and it lasted 6 yrs. Today you can get a VCR for $50-$70 thats true but don't expect it to last even 1 yr. If you want to keep jobs here at home then only buy from those companies that hire the people that buy their product. All the money being spent goes to the big corporate leaders and to a foriegn workforce none of it goes into our economy. Stop shopping at Wal-Mart and the dollar stores shop for only the products that are made in America by Americans who will use their paychecks to purchase products here in America and not in china furthering their economy while sitting idly by watching whats left of ours disappear over the horizon. Point fingers all you want but if your shopping for products made in other countries you are to blame for the economy as much if not more that companies that send jobs overseas. Stop buying from those companies let them fail and remember when those companies that take their place use only americans for their workforce you buy from them and maybe we can turn the economy around for those that may come after we are long gone.
We had the same addiction to Japan in the early 90's but Clinton fixed that problem,because theJapanees were manipulating their currency and growing to big to fast. The Chinese are doing the same thing but they will buckle under their artificial economy, its just a matter of time. Unlike the US we manufacture cutting edge quality were more and more of Chinese product are toxic or junk . The US economy will simply use the cheap labor market they have but eventually the Chinese have to make their economy more transparent.
What americans have to start doing is start working together.. instead of the " Obama has wrecked this country " to " lets work on things and get the country working again "... stop buying things made and build in China.. Start spending more of you cash on good things made right here... The funny thing is that Americans are too cheap to do that.. we love our Wal-Mart ( 95% China's goods ). We are our own worst enemy's.
american customers want cheap goods right? You dont want to pay $80 for levis jeans. So that's the answer.
Publicly, the Chinese dismiss the Obama administration’s calls to let its currency rise. Chinese officials insist the United States is using Beijing as a scapegoat for its own economic troubles.
==========
Let the US lower the value of the US$ and presto problem solved.
I believe that all the countries of the world should have an equal standing as far as there should be a single global monetary currency.
Countries may start acting more like collaborators rather than prey and victim if there was a single monetary unit were in place.
I am not saying all of the countries of the world should be united into one nation, only establishing an equal playing field.
It is well known that wars are fought over gold. In the future wars are going to be fought over trade imbalances which is more than equivalent to gold.
Having an international currency will not solve all the problems of the world but I do think it will take the straw off the camels back.
Many U.S. citizen are out of work because of global currency profiting. It is simple math. If you can pay someone in a foreign nation 2 dollars a day to make your product and an Americans cost of living does not permit this than the company wanting to produce that product will go overseas.
Yeah, keep blaming on Obama and democrat and your American problem will just go away. Stop crying and complaining just because Obama won the election and you LOST.
It is really funny for me USA is pushing this hard for yuan appreciation. In short term, yes, this might help a little for US exporters but it will also increase the price tag of everything in USA instantly which will make people in US to loose their purchasing power. For China it will be visa versa. I believe in mid term, yuan appreciation may increase the purchasing power of Chinese. Their exports might fall (more like stay still) a little bit but due its enormous domestic market this will not affect Chinese manufacturers at all. Moreover, appreciation of yuan will only help US exporters competing with Chinese counterparts. How many sectors do you know USA is competing with China? I think it is almost nothing. This so called "battle" is nothing substantial. The problem is bigger for US. Yuan value has very little (if any) to do with it.
Blame global trade. If American Companies don't buy from China, they buy from other 3rd-world countries.
Why China become the American factory, because Chinese government support it and American government support it too.
If American government want to keep our employee in the U.S., it will happen.
Yes, we can buy cheap stuffs from oversea, but finally, we will lost our jobs and we can buy nothing.
Where was the money go? All our money went to a small bunch of people, they are heads of American companies.
*** Obama and this current crop of democrats have destroyed more jobs in a much shorter period of time than the total that has ever been sent overseas. ****
Oh shut up, you useless imbecile. Most of the job losses were before Obama even took office. What a moron.
China has been doing to us what we have done to so many other countries for so long. It is taking a piece of us, driving us into debt that we cannot possibly pay back and exploiting its relationship to its financial and geo political advantage. It is our own fault each administration has known what it is doing but they all just want what the last administration wants which is another term. They forget about what will happen when they leave because they dont really care that much it is a ways to a means. The political geniuses believe that if you control the DOW everything else will take care of its self. It is utter financial insanity and it will lead to a giant collapse in the US economy the very minute we cross China due to the fact that the US dollar is more vulnerable than it has been since before the 2nd World War. I believe that the only hope for the US is that China implodes to such civil unrest that it drives it's self into a civil war which is very possible as the haves and the have not's become further and further apart and Western ideologies make it's way into more and more Chinese house holds, this will happen it's only a matter of time thanks in most to the internet....stay tuned as one of us are seriously SOL.
The incessant whining and moaning written here is pathetic. There is such an unreasonable, almost radical resentment, fed by nonsense and jealousy, towards the US. One can understand the envy and resentment of sclerotic Europe with their stagnating performance and self-declared diminishing international influence; of the violent and woefully unproductive Middle East; and, despite a few recent years of progress, the consistently underperforming, first-to-blame-the-US Latin America. But for those of you are Amerian, you clearly have no self-worth, and it must feel falsely enlightening, almost cathartic to take cheap shots at the most successful, open, diverse, and self-critical nation in history. And maybe it hurts that a paper which traditionally is inclined to support your "down with America" sentiment, and has now published a factual and realistic picture of America's role in the world, rather than the fantasies some here have of America declining. Despite the sentiment here,keep in mind:
1) The US is the world's largest manufacturer, with a gross output of nearly $5 trillion ( />$2 trillion in GDP contribution) producing 20% of all the world's manufactured goods, a market share it has held for decades – Japan and the EU have had their shares decline precipitously, something rarely noted – also America produces one-third of all the world's high tech goods. (manufacturing jobs have been lost in less competitve industries, yet has remained strong in higher and higher value industries)
2) Spends 45% of the world's research and development money, guarenteeing future prosperity
3) At $15 trillion, it remains by far the largest economy in the world
4) The US is deliberative, self-critical, and self correcting, and so unlike envious Europe and the Middle East, it is dynamic and fluid, changing as it needs to–identifying problems and rapidly fixing them
5) Its unmatched culture of leading universities, think-tanks, public debates, entrpreneurship, coupled with its domination of technology and science provides it with an extraordinary productivity and potential.
6) Despite the French, and some other poor losers, the US, without imposing, has the most attractive culture the world over; this is a reflection of the overt and subtle things about America and Americans which makes it so emulated and great.
7) The net worth of Americans even after the 'Great Recession' is some $60 trillion, a sum equivalent to the entire world's annual output (GDP).
So before the masses return to ranting and raving, and before they decide to point out every flaw in a masterpiece, acknowledge it is a masterpiece and all which makes it great.
What's interesting to me are two previous comments. One referring to dumb and lazy americans. I want to know which americans that person was referring to. I have held down manual labor jobs for years while my wife completes med school. When shes done I can start working on med school. Secondly, I like the comment regarding smart and weak China and dumb and strong U.S.A. China is less cunning on the world scene yet a much more formidable force militarily. Compare America's 1 million man force to China's 140 million man force
Over 4 times the size of China by GDP,40% of the world's R&D spending, world's largest manufacturer making 20% of all the goods in the world and 35% of all the high tech goods (depsite silly and wishful perceptions to the contraray), an unmatched military, superb universities, high end VC, an entrepreneurial, industrious, and innovative culture, all coupled to an incredible and incessant ability to constantly be introspective and change, the US has not and is not a 'shadow of itself' mind you.
China is growing as it should, its the most populous nation on Earth with an extraordinary history, similar to India. But overlooking its great leap forward and cultural revolution where more Chinese died than killed by Hitler and Stalin put together, a lack of transparency and democracy, a mercantist and unsustainable economic model, i.e. artificially low currency and interest rates, forced exports, asset bubbles etc, China itself has many, many issues not to mention the worst demographic issue in the world where it will become the first nation to grow old before it grows rich.
No doubt its cathartic for many, particularly some in declining Europe or those of similar persuasion to speak of any form of American decline, particularly during a recession, but as usual it is wishful thinking with no anchor in reality.
I've said for YEARS....free trade agreements, enacted by Democrats but long the hallmark of the GOP are bad for this nation! Neither party gets it, but the middle class is the strength of any economy, let alone our own, and we kill the middle class if we destroy the ability to earn a liviving in manufacturing.....if we put the CONSUMER as the king! Given all the safety and environmental standards in addition to the standard of living, we can never compete with Chinese (or Indian) business, so why try if it means the death knell?
I've said for years, levy import taxes on and any and all goods to the extent it makes Chinese goods as expensive as US goods. We can support ourselves!!!
China who? April 12th, 2010 10:23 pm ET
Its obvious the Chinese have bought the BS hype economists have been blindly spewing for the sake of slave labour wages.
Stop trade and see the Paper Dragon fold like a cheap suit. China's cheap labour can be replaced, as India and Vietnam are already proving.
Its too bad money isn't real or else the debt might actually mean something."
Agree.
It is not the currency issue. It is the culture, spirit, and people factors. Even if the U.S. dollar equals to one Yuan, it still cannot help U.S. economy.
Look into the living standards of U.S. and China. It is heaven and earth. In the U.S., You travel from west coast to east coast and find most Americans living in detached single house. The majority of the majority Chinese live in apartments. Americans drive cars individually, Chinese take public transporation. Americans go to grade school or middle schools withmore than 30 students in one classroom considers as a disaster. In China, forty to fifty students in one classroom is very normal. In China, workers working overtime without pay is the way to keep their jobs securely. Who dares to challenge their bosses ? In America, workers can sue their boss all the way to bankrupcy. In America, schools without air conditioned is against human rights. In China, people do not understand, the difference between room temperature and outside temperature. Year round, there is only one temperature, the mother nature temperature.
In America, very few school children have even seen a hand with frozen moisture under the skin. but it is so common to Chinese children in winter time. The Chinese work to survive, Americans work to get luxuries lives.
On radio, televsion, newspaper, Americans fight for ideology. Every day the self -proclaimed genius talk show hosts argue and divide the nation into conservative or liberal terrorities. Today's America is experiencing Chinese Cultural Revolution forty years ago. In China, who cares who you are. Today's Chinese only care about working and making money. People talking about ideology are considered as mentally retardly in today's China.
Can Americans sacrifice their ways of living standard ? No way. How can Americans fight with average Chinese making only $200 per month ? Do Amercians have the spirit to fight ? No way! Just look the so called conversative Fox Channel. It is saturated with sex orientated programs. Amercians love sex. From middle schoolers to stupid evil self ordained Dr. Consertvative, Rush Limburgh. By the way, how many times Mr. Limburge has been mariied, divoiced ?
Lai Shen
A Chinese
Balance the Budget! nobody can take advantage of this country if the budget is balanced....they are funding our overexpansion of government and entitlement based economy...balance the budget and things would fix themselves....
The way to regain our leverage against China and other nations is to stop borrowing up to our neck, cut taxes and grow our economy. But of course, this means drastically cutting back on our social entitlement programs- a sacrifice that most on this board are not willing to make. The bottomline is: you just can't have is both way. You want cheap oil, you need to go to war. You want cheap stuff, you need to outsource jobs to places like China. You want to live beyond your means, you need to borrow from places like China. You want to have your government provide everything for you, you need to trade in your super-power status. That's just the way it is.
This is as much Obama's fault as it is Bush. Our politicians have been working with corporate lobbyists selling out our country for years. All in the name of instant gratification and quick money. Well, here it is, delivered on a silver platter. This is what it looks like and it's not glamarous. If people don't begin to get involved and vote out ALL incumbents, we are doomed.
China will collapse because it has too many people to sustain growth and not enough internalized resources. It is just a bigger Japan and that country collapses every 75 yrs.
The US is sitting pretty and we don't know jack about it.
The US has the largest energy deposits in the World – clean coal. The US will be the next Kuwait once the Arab oil wells dry (forget about Mexico, their tapped and the Russia is too cold to grow squat) up which is less than ten years away. Barring some incredible energy discovery the US will control World Energy for at least the next five hundred years because they can purify it at a far cheaper price.
One more thing, history has proven that they have become a stagnant culture. If it wasn't for India or the Europeans the Chinese would still be whacking the rice.
China's success will be short lived and you can bet your life and your kids life on that guarantee.
This too shall pass. Eventually, Chinese workers will want higher pay and better living conditions. In the US, Unions demanded too high wages and government imposed too many regulations, so it was too expensive to manufacture in the US.
One other factor people keep missing: China's growth is fueled partly by its one-child policy, which allows middle-aged workers to be more productive and not spend money on unproductive children. This can only last so long because eventually there will not be enough workers to care for the elderly.
"China doesn't like America telling it what to do? America calls the shots on this planet. China has two options: Do what America tells it to do, or leave the planet. We'll give them a few months to decide.
The USA is the ruler of the world. China is a mere pawn in our global agenda. Do not falter my fellow Americans. Do not put up with the rebellious nature of our subordinate countries."
You're right!
My job went to Mexico. Thanks NAFTA
The biggest "threat" to the U.S. is complacency and laziness, whatever China does to capitalize on that is incidental. Other than just spend money on things, what do we as a nation "do" better or more efficiently than anyone else in the world?
In the 90's, we did computers & I.T. better than anyone, & the world beat a path to our door. The result was the one of the greatest economic expansions in modern history. Over time, however, countries like India got better & more efficient than us & we've lost a lot of that business.
Other than gripe & complain, what have we done about this? Has the primary focus been on investing money in new technologies & industries & retraining the workforce? No. It's been throwing monopoly money at existing industries to prop them up so they can fall again like a row of Humpty Dumptys. Or using people's tax dollars to trade-in U.S.-built "clunkers" for Japanese built new cars.
The GOP started most of these problems, but the Obama Admin hasn't done a whole lot to fix it, & our national credit card is getting maxed out.
Just wanted to sort of straighten out some comments made, where it was blamed on President Bush. The overseas selling of Factories and technogy took place during the Clinton years, I remember people complaining because the Clintons were selling out the store so to speak, they were selling technology to China, which helped pay down the deficiet. By the time nine years ago when they joined the World Trade, China had already experienced this major rise in world trade, this is when the damage to the American economy began to show u, but it was already in place. .China emerged as a major player. A lot of American's became rich moving their factories to china, and selling to America. It goes back to the Lobbiest. They are what runs the government, not the people.
China is the model nation for the New World Order. Police state, one child policy, slave labor, and no free speech or individual gun ownership.
Anyone notice how the Chinese are importing the illusion of American "freedom" through McDonalds, Nike, Coca Cola, and AT&T while we are importing a police state, wiretaps, assaults on our free speech, right to bear arms, and lower wages?
Before one more person blames something on "Corporate Greed", answer these questions.
1. Do you always shop for the "lowest price"?
2. Do you own stock in an American company?
If you answer yes to either of those questions, YOU are part of the problem, not the "corporation" that you support by either A, buying the products they produce in China, or B, owning stock and demanding they give you a "fair" return.
China in all ways, except for its population, is about a fifth of the might of the US including its navy, modern air force, GDP, nuclear arsenal, and pretty much everything that matters are only 1/5th of what the US has. The paranoid folks in the US complains that China is taking over the world forgot the facts that China holds over 1.3 billion people and is per capita, only the 90th richest nation in the entire world. In other words, it is natural for a nation like China to expand rapidly simply because it has such as massive untapped labor force. When you realize how poor the Chinese actually are, how obsolete their technologies are, and how poor they are in resources other than titanium and uranium, you would realize that China is about as big of a treat to the US as an ant to a grizzly bear. When you consider the hard facts of total weapons sales and number of wars waged ever since WWII, you would realize that the US has caused more problems to the world than China which is by the way completely intermingled with the US economy because of their dependency to the US dollar.
hey, Mike F
That's because you're an English teacher. If you had a real job like in technology or engineering, or even teaching Science, well, you'd be living in a First World nation come September, like me.
Things that are made in china are cheeper because the labor is cheeper the currency has nothing to do with it. And obamas socializing of america isn't helping our debt
Do the world a favor and boycott China! They already have way to much influence over American politics and are the worst polluters in the world. It is easy to manufacture when you have no restrictions or moral conscience. Can't you see our country's wealth declining...why? Because it is all going overseas. Support your own economy–don't wait for the politicians to try and help you. They are owned by foriegn interests.
All the US has to do is stop buying China's junk and the country will go broke.
40 million male Chinese with no spouse... hmmm.. what do you do with 40 million men? Meanwhile, we disarm households in the US. Build an army of disgruntled men.. and disarm the opposition so that they will not be a threat.. sounds like something evil this way comes...
Over the last ten years when Americans saw their jobs move to China or complained Made in China products caused a loss of Americans jobs CNN, except for Lou Dobbs, ignored their voices. CNN was always critical of "protectionism". Now, suddenly the zionists in the Obama administration complain and CNN listens because CNN is owned and run by zionists, not Americans. Now the zionists want a scapegoat so they pick China, probably as a prelude to blaming China for all America's debt, unemployment and loss of high paying manufacturing jobs. The truth is the zionists caused America's mess and are the ones to blame.
It is blame-others-feel-good articles like this that is our problem. To have the guts to imply that the Chinese monetary policy is the culprit speaks volumes about the ignorance and fictitious bubble that people such as the author of this article live in. The only reason the US dollar is not completely worthless is because it serves as a world currency.
The plight of the United States can be attributed solely to President Bill Clinton who persuaded our elected congressmen to vote WTO status to China. Anyone with an ounce of intelligence could foretell what was going to happen. While U.S. Presidents since Clinton have proudly stood up in front of the American people and boasted that we can compete with anyone, the Chinese did not allow their currency to float, violated the world's environment, and in effect, allowed slave laboring by outlawing any labor movements or unions. These actions completely threw out any chance for fair and equal trade with other nations and put the Chinese on top. Too bad our politicians are too lily-livered and cowardly jaundiced to step up and say "ENOUGH IS ENOUGH"! Tariffs and duties are now the only answer to compete!!
Thank your friendly neighborhood republican for selling us out!!! Now, I have to start learning Chinese!!!
Gosh. I'm gonna have to think long and hard on this one.
I would like China far more if they would stop loaning trillions of dollars to our moronic Congress to spend, spend, spend driving us into eternal debt.
I'm not worried about china, don't really care about them or any other country for that matter. I'm just loving and living my life.
Its obvious the Chinese have bought the BS hype economists have been blindly spewing for the sake of slave labour wages.
Stop trade and see the Paper Dragon fold like a cheap suit. China's cheap labour can be replaced, as India and Vietnam are already proving.
Its too bad money isn't real or else the debt might actually mean something.
So wonderful to see our jobs sent overseas...I wonder, who allowed this to happen? 2001-2008...who was president then, who? Can't remember his name...Shrub? Tree? Something like that.
I do remember who supported him and I do vote, however.
Somehow, the after reading this report it does not correlate with comments with French President Sarkozy who stated that China's development was good for the world, because it reduces the risk of internal threats within China that may spread to the world. As China may be the banker, but we are the client and the Chinese view clients as important to their business. China still has a long way to go before it can claim that its population has reached status quo with the West. Same goes for India.
We need to remove a lot of the harmful regulations that make us less competitive.
Until folks stop purchasing "made in China" merchandise (large or small items) we will continue to support the Chinese agenda. You can't blame companies that try to capatalize on cheap Chinese labor. But you CAN stop buying their products. And I would LOVE to see more "made In the USA" labeled products on the shelves. I would pay a premium right now if I had the choice to help keep my spent dollars IN the country. I am not against free trade. I am not against China. I AM against the completely unbalanced trade ratio. I AM against the way too quick evaporation of manufactoring jobs in favor of opening new plants in China. It was allowed to happen WAY too quick. Did not give our country enought time to retool our workforce. Nobody was watching while a few CEO's and government fat cats lined their pockets....
It is quite obviously Bush's fault. I'm not sure why, but I've been told this over and over by the MSM for 10 years now.
Global trade etc is good...but the trade should be balanced. Currently with most manufacturing being shipped to China , we are losing a valuable real time lab for the young people. America's greatness in science and technology was as much a result of on the job inventions and improvisations as was university research.
I like to call a manufacturing floor as a real time lab and it is gone...
The business in China are not pure profit driven capitalist business...
when a bank keeps on providing financing without consideration of repayment capabilities and other fundamentals, the state owned co. keeping on supplying raw materials on infinite credit, the labor laws so manipulated and labor kept artificially cheap.... how can a for profit american business which has to make interest payments quarterly on its debt...has to pay prewailing wage and benefits to its workers, has to buy raw materials in a open competitive bidding and then return a decent profit to its investors...how can such a business even come close to compete with a state owned no economic sense business in China...
I see people enraged when jobs are moved to India or when they have to speak to a customer service guy in Philipines or India..but the same people happily buy and gobble all cheap Chinese goods...
china is like all authoritarian regimes. they only do what they want to and force is the only tool they understand. slap trade restrictions on them and print enough money to pay our debt to them. in other words, screw them to the wall. they would do it to us in a heartbeat. they may be unscrutable but a good kick in the rear would fix that.
China is GREAT if you're the CEO or other upper management drawing a 7 figure salary looking to net another fat bonus by firing American workers and outsourcing. Go China! You're making the rich 1% of America even richer!
For last decade, be it prosperity or war – Chinese have indirectly funded American excesses. My son wondered when he was 5 years – why every toy that he set his eyes on in every store on is made in China. It is rather queer to expect China to toe American line when the latter is in the driving seat. Pressuring China is impossible and there is nothing to wonder about it. Americans have no leverage with any nation as they are burdened with debt at record levels.
Chinese or Russia want to apply brakes on road to sanctions on Iran since they knew what happened to Iraq. Secondly, do sanctions work? If it had, then sanctions should have broken Iraq so that the war would have been unnecessary. But sanctions failed with Iraq and N.Korea.
Countries are seeking nuclear power do so to strengthen their deterrence after witnessing what happened in Iraq.
Also everyone knows as Americans we cannot afford another war. Economically, because billions have been wasted in wars. Militarily too wars are no longer a cakewalk for anyone. For instance NATO army designed to fight Soviets is struggling to fight a loose knit Ill-trained and ill-equipped enemy for close to 10 years though the latter has absolutely no tactical advantage. Soviet military machine was ousted from Afghanistan. All these have not been lost in Chinese political circles.
As Americans, Economy is OUR CURRENCY. A strong economy can create diplomatic leverage, military advantage and so on. Second is to become competitive through exports and job creation. Third to be energy independent. Fourth is to strengthen our education to be competitive. The list goes on. Premier Wen Jiabao is right , we have our issues to interfere in how China or anybody does their business.
Besides going aggressive against China is trying to bite the hand that feeds!
we got what we asked for-cheaper prices and a loss of our jobs
Good Morning America! Google – "clinton china domain" – a might interesting reading material. It will keep you captive for hours and take you back in history prior to WWI. As always with government, family and friends, while you see one hand doing something, it is always best to find out what the other is up to! Believe it or not, we Americas have sold our very homeland to another country. I hang my head in shame...I server 20+ years in the military defending this great country for what, for I too have been fooled...
I'm sick and tired of seeing everything I buy "MADE IN CHINA" we need to re-org the way we do business. We need to reclaim America, its our home not theirs.
Free Trade is killing the American workers in a lot of ways and we need to bring it to an end.
We got politicians in Maine trying to pass a bill to allow non US citizens to vote because we are a Democracy and they feel everyone in our country should have a vote. Citizen or not.
Wake up people, flush the bombers and wake the dogs we got issues that need attention right now. not later.
I think its kind of ironic that we're criticizing China for the same things we did to Europe and Asia all those years back. And the funny thing is that we basically set these rules! I do believe that we are merely getting a sour taste of our own medicine.
Many thanks to the baby boomers for selling our future. Good job
Interesting!
I'd like to ask this question to all the super smart capitalists or free market Guru's from the GOP. If we're so smart in this capitalist society , why is communist China our lender to the great USA?? Maybe we're not as smart or as powerfull as we think we are?
Bush began and carried on two wars while Americans continued to lose jobs. Amazing.
If we fight them, they will effectively become a threat; if we view their rise as opportunistic (after all, isn't that was capitalism is all about?), we will be able to balance our economy with theirs.
We can't fight this, this is history happening. We can use it to our advantage so America doesn't collapse or we can stoop to humanity's most basic instinct, which we've seen fail for civilizations so many times over. Don't think we'd be immune to it!
China cannot be trusted. Since all our business want to set-up factories in china while their CEO enjoy the benifits and wealth this brings them while living in this country. The time has come to ship these CEO to china, they can enjoy the benifits and their wealth in that country.
Being upset at China about losing a job is about the same as being upset at an inventor that created a machine that made one's job obsolete. There will always be progress and we should be busy trying to figure out how to take advantage of that progress, not how to blame others for it.
Yeah, it'll be interesting when China hit's a wall and the population realizes not all of them are going to be able to join that middle class so proud of the riches being built off the back of the peasants.
if china doesn't grow economically billions of people will be starving.
When China raises the exchange rate on its Yuan in the upcoming months, that will certainly effect the enormus import trade defecit America now has with China.
Ideally that would open the doors for many manufacturing company's in America to fill the sudden need for cheaper goods.
However the Republican led Corporations have largely all moved overseas to avoid paying taxes and to fully exploit cheap child labor leaving America mostly unable to muster up any adequate manufacturing content of their own these days.
Thanks to the Republican lawmakers, it's to late to save America's manufacturing sectors, they've all gone overseas.
It seems to be true that all of our economic woes are not tied to China's way of valuing their currency and I think most of us (who are thinking) realize that.
I think that a more realistic statement (ours) would be something to the effect of: "We (the Americans) have transferred too much of our economy to China." We have been buying too many non-american made products and remained oblivious to our jobs moving overseas. We have allowed our collective attention to daydream while our business owners have sold us and our technologies out.
So the Chinese Government is right to say that (our total) predicament is not the result of their (lets call it what it is) currency manipulation. However; even though that is not the cause for our total problem it would seem to even a person as uninformed as myself that their currency manipulation is their rabbit punch or punch below the belt.
Our best response might be more self reliance and a truly "protectionist" attitude. If we had this "protectionist" attitude that they claim we do, we never would have wound up in this unsatisfactory condition.
We have been acting the opposite of protectionist ... self inflicting.
I interviewed for an excellent position with a Chinese company that is headquartered here in the U.S. It required travel to China. Throughout the entire interview, all I thought about was Tiananmen Square and how I thought I'd never, in my life, work for a company owned by a Communist government.
Of course it's bad that China is becoming more economically powerful than the United States.
Eventually, we will "pay" for our inexpensive goods.
Wr are not only creating the beast, we are feeding the beast. Undoubtedly, we will one day have to hold off the beast. The question is, will we be able to do it? I doubtt it!
China has been rising as a military and economic superpower for years while we are becoming weaker. And the question is if China rising is bad for us? Here's solution to the jobs situation, provide funding for the draft so that Americans have jobs that will protect this nation and also learn that freedom isn't free. You don't want to know how bad China's military outnumbers us. Oh by the way, don't they have a growing space program while we have called it quits with the Shuttle or any other manned pursuit in space? So much for American passion for exploration and setting new standards. Wonder how much Russia and China will charge NASA to transport our astronauts to the International Space Station?
The Chinese will come begging when they need others, and spit on them when they no longer need help. History has shown it over and over. It's the only country that has had problems with all its neighbors in its thousand years of history. It had grabbed lands from Tibet, islands in the South China sea, it has its eyes on other parts of the world. Wait until they get their military all modernized, they won't be afraid to shoulder us right out of the way. Jerks!
Having spent 4 years in China recently, I must say I am impressed with what they have done. Their embrace of population control has helped them. Their focus on education has made them the smartest country in the world. Their strict enfoecement of laws, designed to protect the innocent instead of the guilty, has really helped them reduce crime. If you are a law abiding citizen in China, you have nothing to worry about. They have high expectations of their people, and most of them respond. They have a great work eithic like I have never seen. Here in the US, these things at one time were our passion. We have lost many of them now. China is definitely passing us, and within the next 100 years will be the new world power that we hold now. Say what you want, argue, complain. Yes, they have a demanding government with high expectations. But if you think about it, all countries should have high expectations of their citizens rather than feeling like they must provide for many of them.
I just can't believe it how dumb are some of our business leaders and our previous administration when they allowed China and other Asian Nations enrich themselves at the expense of the United States. Basically they were the smart ones, they not only took all of our markets, China, Japan and others, but some of our business leaders transfered their technology to them as a condition to do business in China., very smart from them, they got what they want and are producing every major appliances and cars in mass production, they are selling them cheaper than us and the result is loss of jobs in the millions, decline, poverty, crime, etc. in America, We are in deep trouble, Japan, already took General Motors, Ford and Chrysler Markets, Sony, already bought a major movie studio and before we know it, THE ASIAN POWERS WILL OWE AMERICA. To make matters worst, we have open markets to all of them, but they have closed markets to us, but even if we have open markets in all of those nations, their people are PENNY PINCHERS, they buy the basics, don't like to buy nice and expensive items and are good at saving money, THEY ARE THE PEOPLE WITH THE HIGHEST SAVINGS IN THE WORLD. To change their mentality is almost mission impossible, in Japan, they are brain washed that all foreing products are inferior to their products and as a result the must buy their own.that's why we have the highest trade deficits with all of them. Our government are allowing them to get away with it. China will take over The United States as the number one economy in the world in the near future if we don' do something about it., Their weakness is that the are copycatters, they like to copy what others invent or create.
What a joke, "it took many Americans by surprise....," I'm really curious under what bunker most Americans have been living in the last century. China (dba United States of America). I'm really finding this article identifying that the United States has move most of it's financial control to the Chinese. Going forward, the Chinese will overtake American dominance in the global spectrum.
What does this mean for Americans? The real joke is yet to be told. Remember, your 401K.....Chinese owned and sponsored, the IRS is just the middle man. 🙂
China Mart aka Wal-Mart did a lot to destroy American small and mid-size manufacturing. True they brought low prices to the consumer but at what cost to the American worker?
The wealthy and their politicians have sold this country down the river with "free trade" and sucking up to the Chinese. China may be corrupt and send us poisoned toys and construction materials and shoddy goods but then we have members of Congress trying extortion and calling it Congressional privilege re Ben Nelson and the Senator from Louisianna who was or is holding up the promotion of a Brigader General until the Army agrees to build 3 projects in his state.
The government no longer serves the people only themselves and the wealthy. No wonder China is in the asendenancy.
one day soon we will wake up and find China not only will control us because of the money we owe them, but also because they will soon be a "SUPER POWER". I wonder how many "ATOM BOMBS" they will have when we have cut ours back to (500). By the way, all that copper they keep buying also makes one hell of a lot of bullets.
China's manipulation of its currency is just the tip of the iceberg. The underhanded domestic policies, the killing of its own unborn, the "confidential" genocide...the list goes on. The lack of ethics is the only defining mark of the contemporary Chinese culture. Soon, the eye of its storm will swallow its whole.
Americas lead in every possible way is failing. Our global dominance from the past is slowly becoming a distant memory. We will not fall from attack but fall from our own ignorance that nothing can stop our country. We are destroying it from the inside out. Our own people have become the cancer that will force us into change.
Both American political parties stabbed working class, and middle class families in the back when they gave China, MFNTS.
To say nothing of the additional harm done to our economy with NAFTA.
Millions of long term unemployed people make for long term poor consumers, resulting in a long term US economic downturn.
Take a look at the decline of our dollar over the past decade, if we had a successful economic policy would so many Americans have lost jobs, and would the US dollar have lost as much value as it has?
We can't perpetually float our economy on stock market, housing, and Wall Street funny money derivate bubbles.
If we want prosperity in the US we have to bring jobs and production back to America.
We should force China to float its currency, and if they refuse we should levy import duties on their exports to the US.
Trying to get the world addicted to the US dollar has bankrupted our nation. And we can thank corporate greed for dribbling honey into our elected officials ears that open trade would be a good thing for everyone in America. It was good a thing, for HP, Wal-Mart, Dell and every other company’s product that are now made in China. Some one needs to pay for our lost tax base here. And if big business wants to buy Chinese and fire US workers, well let them pay for it in import taxes! Say NO to WTO!
China is either lying or delusional by calling America 'protectionist'.
I have many negative things to say about American style business, but one thing you could never, ever accuse Americans of being is 'protectionist'.
China is controlling currency flows and setting prices – that is by definition 'protectionist' and they shouldn't be allowed into the WTO while still doing this. Both China and America can be hypocritical at times – but on this specific issue, China is hypocritical.
China must float their currency – until then they should face trade sanctions.
Of course China is a threat! Don't call me paranoid when I tell you that all those blunders, for example, tainted dog food, baby formula and on and on was no "mistake".
I was in a Chinese restaurant the other day and the Maitre D' was bragging about the better economic opportunities in China with a malicious grin on his face. I thought this guy is saying more with that punk grin than his words are!
china can collapse so America can go back to being #1.... with our inventiveness and bringing back our production base in house... the slumbering comatose giant would reawaken in the 21st century.
While I acknowledge that free trade between countries is all part of global commerce, the fact is that we are in a dangerous position owing so much money to China, not investing in our military and national defense, trying to place "nice" with Muslim nations whose citizens want to destroy us. It's time to be proud of our country, invest in strengthening its national security which requires jobs to do so, and invest more in American products and regain our national pride. We are not a superpower and it is just a matter of time before many nations realize that and align themselves against us. Enough diplomacy and trying to get along with other nations who don't like us; we need to invest in Americans getting along with Americans and spend more time helping oiur fellow Americans before we worry about everyone else.
Mr. Udden just lost his job to foreign outsourcing. He is optimistic about his future. This is a game of "musical chairs." With each passing year there will more jobs lost, and fewer to find. I hope Mr. Udden remains optimistic. This will help China.
I have spent over 35 years studying China and now that I do understand their modus operandi, China does not like to deal with people like me. China prefers to view the world through her own narrow prism. Things discussed in Chinese among themselves is so protected that if a foreigner hears them, the whole conversation is void and null. It often happened that they forgot that I could understand and read their documentations, and when they realized what they had discussed in front of me, the entire session was "erased from memory" as if it had never happened.
Is China good for America or not, that is not the real question. The real question is what is China's purpose in getting more involved with the outside world? I am sure that China has already developed a far reaching plan and she is implementing it according to traditional Chinese thinking. She does not want" to shake the world" she just wants to rearrange it.
You can't really blame China. The United States allowed them into a great position to them to control the United States' economy. It happened because of the ignorance of the President and Congress.
The rise of China as an economic power, a world force for the future, should be no surprise to anyone, it's been coming for more than 50 years. The same is true for India, a country we don't hear that much about but will likely also continue to rise to similar world power. There are a lot of reasons, not the least is the vast numbers of population, but also the raw will of the people, and innate intelligence of those populations (which the US has too, but unfortunately seems to lack the will). Toss in the fundamental Buddhist beliefs that dominate those populations, (Buddhism isn't really so much an organized religion as it is a belief system for going through life successfully – if you don't understand that, then you should read about it). America is the greatest county in history, but to sustain that it will require better education, a re-formatting of the country's thinking process, and an improved work ethic.